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The Icon Bar: Games: Advertising
 
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[mentat] Message #85045, posted by mentat at 02:19, 20/12/2000, in reply to message #85044
AA refugee
Posts: 20
also accesible on Desktop PCs - now all we need is a RO 3.7/4 emulator which makes the most of an Athlon monkey

...and we'll be half way to ditching our wonderful RISC OS hardware* and along a path to the demise of the market as we know it.

monkey is about right.

*let's not start a discussion about that on this "games/advertising" thread, eh?

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Shane Message #85046, posted by Ramuh at 12:33, 20/12/2000, in reply to message #85045
AA refugee
Posts: 35
...and we'll be half way to ditching our wonderful RISC OS hardware* and along a path to the demise of the market as we know it.

monkey is about right.

Oh for goodness sakes......

Sorry, I don't mean to be rude but...

Does everyone always have to look at the worse possible outcome ? Surely having emulators can only be a GOOD thing. It opens up RISCOS to a whole "new" world, to people who have not used one, people who have left the market - that is, people who might otherwise have no interest in the RISCOS market at all.

It fills a gap (the RISCOS laptop) quite nicely, until a real one comes along. No one who seriously wants to use RISCOS for productive work is going to spend 2 grand on a PC laptop JUST to run RISCOS 3.1. An old A7000 is still faster than either emulator, and provides the new screen modes. They hardly pose a threat to new sales, do they ?

How many emulators do you use on your RISCOS box ?

The authors of these programs should be applauded for their hard work. Any product that increases the number of people using RISCOS can only be a good thing.

There's a lot more I could say on this subject, but I won't, I'm too tired to bother.

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Nathan Message #85047, posted by Wrath at 13:02, 20/12/2000, in reply to message #85046
Member
Posts: 154
The main problem I find with emulators is that it seems to be an excuse for pirating software and somehow getting away with it. I'm all for emulators, and call it hypocritical but not for RISC OS 3.5 or over because our market is small and it just takes one burke to copy stuff and stick it on the web and get away with it. This can bring down a market such as RISC OS.
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Shane Message #85048, posted by Ramuh at 13:23, 20/12/2000, in reply to message #85047
AA refugee
Posts: 35
The main problem I find with emulators is that it seems to be an excuse for pirating software and somehow getting away with it. I'm all for emulators, and call it hypocritical but not for RISC OS 3.5 or over because our market is small and it just takes one burke to copy stuff and stick it on the web and get away with it. This can bring down a market such as RISC OS.

Sadly, this is true, although disc image sites in the Acorn world seem to be quite good - there aren't very many (if any) commercial games available on the emulator game sites - most of the ones that are up there are the old (now freeware) Krysalis games and one or two others. I know, for example, that all the Superior Software games have been removed from the two main sites because these are apparently still available commercially (!!!!), and Top Banana was removed from one because the author objected. There aren't AFAIK any 4D games on them, at least not the ones that 4D are still selling.

I'd be surprised if the authors could get the VIDC2 etc working at any decent speed - the poor thing has a struggle reaching ARM3 speeds, never mind ARM7500, so probably RISC OS 3.5 is unlikely.

But hey, I can use USB mice and keyboards with my pseudo Acorn laptop! smile

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Nathan Message #85049, posted by Wrath at 13:27, 20/12/2000, in reply to message #85048
Member
Posts: 154
Sadly, this is true, although disc image sites in the Acorn world seem to be quite good - there aren't very many (if any) commercial games available on the emulator game sites - most of the ones that are up there are the old (now freeware) Krysalis games and one or two others.

This is wrong. Krisalis games are NOT freeware, the rights have defaulted to the original author and are still illegal to play unless you have the original or AU CD (they sought permission).

I know, for example, that all the Superior Software games have been removed from the two main sites because these are apparently still available commercially (!!!!), and Top Banana was removed from one because the author objected. There aren't AFAIK any 4D games on them, at least not the ones that 4D are still selling.

I do know of a site that allows 4D games to be downloaded.

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Shane Message #85050, posted by Ramuh at 13:38, 20/12/2000, in reply to message #85049
AA refugee
Posts: 35

This is wrong. Krisalis games are NOT freeware, the rights have defaulted to the original author and are still illegal to play unless you have the original or AU CD (they sought permission).

I didn't realise that the Krysalis games aren't freeware. In that case, yes, I agree, it's illegal.

I've no idea if the author (Shaun Hollingworth ?) would give his permission or not, but they should certainly ask him.

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Nathan Message #85051, posted by Wrath at 13:47, 20/12/2000, in reply to message #85050
Member
Posts: 154
The rights do not return to Shaun Hollingworth, they return to the original vendor so for instance, Gods returns to the Bitmap Brothers.
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Mark Quint Message #85052, posted by ToiletDuck at 18:48, 20/12/2000, in reply to message #85051
Ooh ducky!Quack Quack
Posts: 1016
Does everyone always have to look at the worse possible outcome ? Surely having emulators can only be a GOOD thing. It opens up RISCOS to a whole "new" world, to people who have not used one, people who have left the market - that is, people who might otherwise have no interest in the RISCOS market at all.

It fills a gap (the RISCOS laptop) quite nicely, until a real one comes along. No one who seriously wants to use RISCOS for productive work is going to spend 2 grand on a PC laptop JUST to run RISCOS 3.1. An old A7000 is still faster than either emulator, and provides the new screen modes. They hardly pose a threat to new sales, do they ?


Well made point - With the current state of the RiscOS market, and also the way in which im having to use the OS at the moment makes it very impractical to have to use our RiscPC - I now use the Internet & Email on PC because unfortunately the RiscPC just Lags too much and makes it a waste of time & Money unhappy
Once I have downloaded the file I then have the issue of moving it onto the RiscPC, which if it is larger than a floppy disk then it causes problems (epecially as the RPC seems to dislike CDRW disks)unhappy
That is where Mr Emulator comes in - I can then store everything on one computer, have quick access to three operating systems, & I also have the advatages of being able to use a decent 17" monitor & a very nice set of speakers smile
Unfortunately the current RiscOS hardware (hopefully this comment should be "invalid" in a few months tongue) is just not up to the job for much of the things i use it for - for the work im doing on Overcast 2 even the PC has problems handling some of the tasks unhappy
so, YAY for emulators,
and m00000000 for piracy because thats just evil (& can see what u mean with emulators possibly ecouraging this, as people interpret the software as part of the emulator, & so dont realise that they are still copyrighted)

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Andrew Message #85053, posted by andreww at 18:59, 20/12/2000, in reply to message #85052
AA refugee
Posts: 555
Thanks for what you are doing Mark.
Developing graphics for games must be a difficult task on any platform as they have to be processed and otherwise tailored according to the game.
It's here though that you really get to know moreabout the limits of the software and hardware you're using. For instance, I'm sure that a Kinetic (if I can ever afford one) would give a noticeable increase in graphics processing and thus be an indirect help to the gamesmarket if not providing the more obvious boost that 3d graphics cards do in enabling more copmlex graphical effects in the game itself.
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Mark Quint Message #85054, posted by ToiletDuck at 21:55, 20/12/2000, in reply to message #85053
Ooh ducky!Quack Quack
Posts: 1016
Thanks for what you are doing Mark.
Developing graphics for games must be a difficult task on any platform as they have to be processed and otherwise tailored according to the game.
It's here though that you really get to know moreabout the limits of the software and hardware you're using. For instance, I'm sure that a Kinetic (if I can ever afford one) would give a noticeable increase in graphics processing and thus be an indirect help to the gamesmarket if not providing the more obvious boost that 3d graphics cards do in enabling more copmlex graphical effects in the game itself.

lol - u dont if I adapt that to suit my parents - They really are taking their time over getting my GeForce2, which means that it is an indirect help to the RiscOS gamesmarket (and of course my entertainment tongue), BECAUSE ATI CARDS ARE EVIL!!! (and dead slow unhappy )
thats one different between RiscOS/PC suppliers & their service.
We got our RiscPC straight off the Castle Technology stand at the Wembley Acorn World show.

When it came to getting my pc, I waited around a month to actually get a quote, it took 2 weeks to finalise the machine, then I waited 6 weeks for it to arrive, and when I did i ended with a "temporary graphics card" because the kind ppl at 3DFX had gone & withdrawn the Voodoo 2000 unhappy
Ah well i though - ill just wait until the manafacturer manages to get hold of one -not quite...
(this is the exscuse i was told) the "supplier" he was using decided to cut all forms of communication and dissapear into thin air.
Then came the brainwave - i had just finished/survived GCSEs, and Geforce prices were getting lower so we would pay a little more and upgrade the card.
We waited several weeks waiting for him to actually find a place that stocked the card (it seemed that any place i suggested was not good enough!)
When we finally got an update of what was happening it was to tell us that the supplier was going into Liquidation, therefore i would not be getting my Graphics Card, nor a refund for the Voodoo.
How about that for service eh? smile
(and on top of that they give me an ATi Xpert 98 to "complement" my PC as a temporary card) grrrr!!!!!!!!!

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Andrew Message #85055, posted by andreww at 23:19, 20/12/2000, in reply to message #85054
AA refugee
Posts: 555
Sounds all very complex Mark :-)
I must say that has been one thing I've enjoyed about using RISC OS, the overall simplicity.
In fact it's one of the main reasons I've always liked Acorns - you just have to plug it in and you can set about programming without too many complex issues and usually good service.
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The Icon Bar: Games: Advertising